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GUEST_USER
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:53 AM
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How fantastic that you understand how to be human.

I hope you spend your entire life in the LaRouche organization and then some.

Mazel tov!



Originally posted on 2018-01-17 06:59:00
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Wubby
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:53 AM
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QUOTE (Guest @ (time=1516190373))
How fantastic that you understand how to be human.

I hope you spend your entire life in the LaRouche organization and then some.

Mazel tov!

How to be human? That's not what I said. What it is to be human, is the quote. I would imagine that you are already human, no? Understanding what you are is something different.

Originally posted on 2018-01-17 23:22:00
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man114
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:53 AM
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QUOTE (Wubby @ (time=1516249320))
QUOTE (Guest @ (time=1516190373))
How fantastic that you understand how to be human.

I hope you spend your entire life in the LaRouche organization and then some.

Mazel tov!

How to be human? That's not what I said. What it is to be human, is the quote. I would imagine that you are already human, no? Understanding what you are is something different.
As a historian myself, I’ve done plenty of research into this, and other cults (Scientology, Heavens Gate, Branch Davidians, etc.). It is a cult.

Brainwashing doesn’t occur? There is evidence of this as far back as Chris White.

If you did this research you can certainly dig through our “gossip” about day to day cult occurrences and all the information is here to show exactly how and why it is.

You say you’re a Polymath? This is supposed to lend you some sort of credibility to your argument? John Agar here on the forum knows me personally and could attest to the fact that I know all sorts of things on a wide variety of subjects but I don’t go around calling myself a polymath. http://b2.ifrm.com/static/emo/7.png

You also talked to the moderator of a conspiracy forum. I wouldn’t lend much credibility to that as a source of information.

Any modicum of research will show that this cult is far from humane. I think the stories of its victims would be plenty of substantiation for that argument. So protecting people against that is inhumane?

Originally posted on 2018-01-18 01:48:00

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"The Greatest Threats to Humanity are Comets, Meteors and Asteroids"

"Anybody who is not making forecasts, useful forecasts, about volcanoes and earthquakes, should be thrown out of public office."

"Well, Schwarzenegger is a sex maniac. He was the world's leading sex maniac. He was promoted directly from Ireland, but not from the Irish; and he was shipped into the United States to become the leader of California. And what he did is he turned the whole California into a bunch of degenerate sex maniacs, and they began doing it very quickly. What we're trying to do is get rid of the sex maniacs out of California"- Lyndon LaRouche
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GUEST_USER
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:53 AM
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QUOTE (Guest @ (time=1516187133))
I'm posting this here, in this old dead thread, because I can't help but notice how consistently wrong are these opinions of LaRouche and this organization.

This comment here. The LaRouche org makes a lot out of telling people that the outside world and everyone in it is evil, irrational, stupid. Don't do their work for them!

This couldn't be any further from the truth, as is most of the nonsense on these forums. It's quite the opposite and at no point in my contact with the organization or its material were there ever any suggestions of this sort, in any way.
I made this statement from personal knowledge of what I witnessed seeing someone I cared about recruited to the cult over a period of months.

So, please understand that I don't care about what you have "studied." I was simply trying to advise someone clearly going through a hard time.

Originally posted on 2018-01-18 18:47:00
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GUEST_USER
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:53 AM
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QUOTE (Guest @ (time=1516319232))
QUOTE (Guest @ (time=1516187133))
I'm posting this here, in this old dead thread, because I can't help but notice how consistently wrong are these opinions of LaRouche and this organization.

This comment here. The LaRouche org makes a lot out of telling people that the outside world and everyone in it is evil, irrational, stupid. Don't do their work for them!

This couldn't be any further from the truth, as is most of the nonsense on these forums. It's quite the opposite and at no point in my contact with the organization or its material were there ever any suggestions of this sort, in any way.
I made this statement from personal knowledge of what I witnessed seeing someone I cared about recruited to the cult over a period of months.

So, please understand that I don't care about what you have "studied." I was simply trying to advise someone clearly going through a hard time.
at no point in my contact with the organization or its material were there ever any suggestions of this sort, in any way.


Ha, but yet you've come here to a dead thread to admonish, mock, and insult. Your hypocrisy is pretty funny.

Originally posted on 2018-01-18 19:04:00
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John Agar
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:53 AM
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QUOTE (man114 @ (time=1516258102))
You say you’re a Polymath? This is supposed to lend you some sort of credibility to your argument? John Agar here on the forum knows me personally and could attest to the fact that I know all sorts of things on a wide variety of subjects but I don’t go around calling myself a polymath.  http://b2.ifrm.com/static/emo/7.png
Pffft.....you WISH you were a polymath like this random new poster


http://b2.ifrm.com/static/emo/7.png

Originally posted on 2018-01-18 20:36:00
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El Ron
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:53 AM
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QUOTE (Guest @ (time=1516187133))
Another interesting thing is in part of my research I also looked at cults. I wanted to understand how it is that a human being could be so naive as to drink the cool aid in spite of witnessing those who previously did the same, perish. How is it that our brains could be susceptible to something that goes against any kind of survival instinct we should all have? I learned how cults are built and the process of brainwashing. LaRouche, in no way, does anything of the sort.
If you made any serious study of cults, specifically Jonestown, you would know that it is false that every one of those people willingly swallowed poison. Many did, but many others were made to. Some ran for the hills and were tracked down and shot if they didn't escape.

Do you think it's possible that we are all just as smart as you and just happen to think you are wrong about LaRouche?

Originally posted on 2018-01-19 14:24:00

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"Remember Lyndon LaRouche? Two hundred and thirty-seven federal marshalls descended on his house one day, and he was never seen again. Seven consecutive life terms for fraud, stupidity, and hubris..." - Hunter S. Thompson (Better Than Sex - 1994)
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fightapathy
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 04:56 AM
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QUOTE (Wubby)
I came to the same conclusion that I balked at just a few years earlier which is the same as LaRouche. Since that time I have continued my learning and much of what LaRouche talks about proves to be true.


I think everyone who posts here had the same revelation as you. We all found things in common with THE DEAR LEADER that drew us to the org. Some of us joined in order to make the world a better place -- only to exit with very bad experiences. Some of us, like me, followed from afar with great interest, only to turn away in disappointment.

The point of this place is that LaRouche's organization is a complete failure and waste of time for everyone involved, which also practices classic cult domination and control techniques to squeeze its membership dry.

Originally posted on 2018-02-01 15:18:00

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If a host cooked a nice meal for you, you would appreciate that. But if she then vomited all over the meal, my guess is that this is what you would remember more than what she cooked. This is the case with the LaRouchies --Dr. Michael Hudson
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Worried X-GF
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 05:03 AM
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I haven't posted in awhile, thought I would update. My ex Bf finally got fired from his state job for "attendance issues". He was having months of trouble,managing getting to work,calling out nearly a day every week and written warning and suspensions followed. Cloret, in her infinite wisdom, advised him to go to a detox,in an effort to "keep his job". Problem was, that Bill Ferguson took him to said detox,but the ex bf didn't let work know till he was already there,which left them to cover his time off with out sufficient notice. This was in December 2017,by March of 2018, he got fired. Cloret's advice was to get a lawyer and get the job back. Sadly, the ex basically spiraled into a deep depression,and was sectioned by his family for a week in a locked psych unit. No phone,so no way to stay in touch with Cloret and Bill. We
(myself and his sister) had his phone.Jesus Christ,Cloret was fucking relentless, calling and texting multiple times a day,day after day.
To say there was evidence of some serious brainwashing and total manipulation is an understatement.
I did speak to Cloret once,when she called, looking for the ex.I mentioned he was in the hospital and his family would like her to not contact him or try and see him anymore,to which she cheerily replied, "OK!" and hung up.

The ex is out of the hospital,but still struggling and seeing a therapist and his PCP,trying to see what meds may help. Sure enough,Cloret and Bill could not stay away for long,and attempted to call him several times. The ex, on one hand is very upset over the "thousands I gave those people",which he cannot get back now that he's unemployed and lost a state pension but still has a mortgage to pay.
While we were at his place,trying to clean it,we came across paperwork for loan applications,which Cloret was attempting to persuade him to take out on his home,in an effort to get that money as well. I had told him previous that this was one their tactics, and was pretty angry to see that had targeted him in his fucked up state. The diagnosis for the sectioning was acute depression, delusions and acute paranoia. He is still listed as acutely depressed and anxious. If there was a god,then there would be a special place in hell for Cloret and Bill, taking close to $20,000 from a guy with serious mental illness and aiding and abetting his illness by working his anxiety and putting his job at risk. The poor guy is fucked,and I don't see him getting a job in his field in the near or distant future,especially not in the private state sector. Cloret and Bill's cash cow dried up,I'm wondering what they'll try and do now. He can't write a fat check for 5 grand if he's broke,can he.

Originally posted on 2018-04-24 14:54:00
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man114
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 05:03 AM
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I don’t know about the law up there but here I know as long as you need help, if you notify the employer you need treatment even if it’s a one day notice they’re obligated to allow you to seek treatment without reprimand. I’d check up on your state law there in regards to it.

The fact they hit him up for $20k and tried to get him to take out a loan is crazy.

I’d still be extremely wary because they might try and convince him to card table full time.

Originally posted on 2018-04-26 10:30:00

--------------------
"The Greatest Threats to Humanity are Comets, Meteors and Asteroids"

"Anybody who is not making forecasts, useful forecasts, about volcanoes and earthquakes, should be thrown out of public office."

"Well, Schwarzenegger is a sex maniac. He was the world's leading sex maniac. He was promoted directly from Ireland, but not from the Irish; and he was shipped into the United States to become the leader of California. And what he did is he turned the whole California into a bunch of degenerate sex maniacs, and they began doing it very quickly. What we're trying to do is get rid of the sex maniacs out of California"- Lyndon LaRouche
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xlcr4life
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 05:03 AM
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My God this is horrific!

QUOTE
The ex is out of the hospital,but still struggling and seeing a therapist and his PCP,trying to see what meds may help. Sure enough,Cloret and Bill could not stay away for long,and attempted to call him several times. The ex, on one hand is very upset over the "thousands I gave those people",which he cannot get back now that he's unemployed and lost a state pension but still has a mortgage to pay.

While we were at his place,trying to clean it,we came across paperwork for loan applications,which Cloret was attempting to persuade him to take out on his home,in an effort to get that money as well. I had told him previous that this was one their tactics, and was pretty angry to see that had targeted him in his fucked up state. The diagnosis for the sectioning was acute depression, delusions and acute paranoia. He is still listed as acutely depressed and anxious. If there was a god,then there would be a special place in hell for Cloret and Bill, taking close to $20,000 from a guy with serious mental illness and aiding and abetting his illness by working his anxiety and putting his job at risk.



This may warrant a report to whatever State Agency is involved in exploitation of disabled/ elderly etc.

http://www.mass.gov/mdaa/mandated-reportin...e-disabled.html

QUOTE
Reporting Suspected Abuse of Persons with Disabilities
A fundamental duty of government is to protect its most vulnerable population - children, the elderly, and those with physical and mental disabilities. While anyone can and should report suspected abuse, Massachusetts requires certain professionals to report suspected abuse to the appropriate protective service agency. Those agencies conduct their threshold investigations and in turn must refer the most serious cases to the local District Attorney.

In the case of adults (persons age 18 through 59) with mental and physical disabilities, Massachusetts Law requires physicians, nurses, dentists, social workers, police officers and others to immediately report suspected abuse to the Disabled Persons Protection Commission (DPPC).

Reports can be filed through DPPC's website or by calling their hotline at 800.426.9009 V/TTY.

The District Attorneys urge Massachusetts citizens to always give the benefit of the doubt to the safety of persons with disabilities. When in doubt, REPORT!



http://middlesexda.com/prosecution/elder-disabled.php



I don't know any details, but there is a history of treatment and care for him. There have been cases of coworkers who have taken advantage of a disabled coworker and had them sign up for loans and credit cards and absconded with the money. Their defense in court was that the money they received was just a series of gifts for being his or her friend .


In the 1980s in NJ, one of our fundraising "specials" was to get our supporters to take out home equity loans to either give us or lend to us with promissory notes. This cult has a very clear history of shenanigans etc with elderly and others etc. One part of my memory goes back to when we had a lonely young male who was handing over his and or his parents valuable coins to fund every end of the world mobe we had going.

Document as much as you can about the history, phone calls and what went on the bank accounts because there may be a hell of a lot more debt in his name via credit cards used to pay for events and things you and his family may not know of. I would treat everything, especially the loan papers as potential evidence in this.


I was absolutely shocked from the court cases and coverage of how much money we were able to extract from supporters that their family did not know of and most of the org did not know of. We have a long history of destroying families and bankrupting supporters that is quite easy for any abuse investigators to find.


BTW, does his PCP and medical providers have knowledge of his history as you have described? This a serious matter if you have any interaction with patients or clients who find too many odd things going on. I have read about many an elderly or disabled person whose injuries or problems were not viewed as "normal" by staff at banks and medical facilities and led to some sort of abuse. Often it is a neighbor , caregiver or "friend" who gains trust and exploits.



I had to reread this a few times.

QUOTE
I haven't posted in awhile, thought I would update. My ex Bf finally got fired from his state job for "attendance issues". He was having months of trouble,managing getting to work,calling out nearly a day every week and written warning and suspensions followed. Cloret, in her infinite wisdom, advised him to go to a detox,in an effort to "keep his job". Problem was, that Bill Ferguson took him to said detox,but the ex bf didn't let work know till he was already there,which left them to cover his time off with out sufficient notice. This was in December 2017,by March of 2018, he got fired. Cloret's advice was to get a lawyer and get the job back



I have absolutely no knowledge of what took place, but this is incredible to read for several reasons. Was he missing work to attend LPAC work in the streets or events so much that had numerous write ups by superiors? Was he put in a position of committing work place fraud for benefits and his attendance ? I think in the past there was an issue with state owned property. A lot of Detox and "sober homes" are fraudulent and just drain every dime of health benefits available. I'll say one frightening thought based on the past. Was there any change in medicine being prescribed by a Doctor , usage and influences on usage as the downward spiral was occurring?

This is all too painful to read because the damage is so familiar to many of us who know the history of what happens to our "supporters"





Originally posted on 2018-04-26 13:07:00
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Worried X-GF
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 05:03 AM
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He is,again,sectioned to a locked psych unit, was in two separate ED's over the past 3 days. The PCP only knows he's been struggling,haven't had a chance to really delve into everything with him,as I'm not the HCP, (Health Care Proxy) that will be his sister.
I talked to him as best as I could before he went to seek some help yesterday. He may have had a
sort of "epiphany" that "they were taking his money" and "this is why Cloret said not to take meds" and "they always told him to go to the office,where the conversations were always regarding money", and "I was basically in a cult". I don't know if he'll still be willing to believe the truth,but it's a start.

His reckless spending is definitely a sign of a serious problem.Thankfully,no retirement or bank accounts were changed to include Cloret or Bill as benefactors. His attendance issues related to his depression and drinking. Often after spending time with Cloret/Bill ,he would be very anxious and his fear based anxiety would mount.Alcohol was the self medication,so he come back from whatever meeting,and get loaded to ease his mind.The anxiety and hangovers were factors in calling out way more than he should have.It didn't help that he would try to engage co-workers in joining the LPAC and soliciting them for money,all of which he was told to stop. I did laugh at the comment someone left on some LaRouche crap he left lying around..."No one is interested in this Commie crap".

I did talk to Bill Ferguson,and re-iterated that he was NOT to attempt to contact him,nor should Cloret or anyone else in the org...that there will be no more money,nor any loans. I also mentioned that a restraining order would be in order should they continue to contact him. The psychiatrist knows of the money issue,so should they pursue him again,actions will taken. Thanks for the heads up on the exploiting info. We are hoping this next stay will be helpful and get him on a much better path. Again,thanks for any advice.

I would like to mention to him the patterns of abuse that you mentioned,when he gets more clear headed. Any evidence to help show him how much these people suck,and how important it is to stay away from them. They have been nickel and diming him for at least 2 years,I'm surprised this didn't get even more out of hand.





Originally posted on 2018-04-27 01:22:00
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xlcr4life
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 05:03 AM
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"this is why Cloret said not to take meds"


This is very, very serious. The best guess I have at this time is that the PCP and Therapist and other people who are licensed and practicing medical professionals who are involved in his overall care should know as much as possible about what is the back ground to this. I don't find this so much different than a patient under care who has a nightmare family situation or other problems that a medical provider should know to treat someone for different problems.


Document as much as possible from the very beginning and don't be surprised at credit card charges and if cards exist that you don't know about. Based on the state and the laws, adults who have been diagnosed and treated for different spectral disorders who live independently are shielded differently in certain conditions than another adult. When I was in this cult back in the 1980s , there was not any knowledge of Alzheimer's or Senile Dementia compared to today. If we had an elderly supporter empty their bank accounts and take out loans and whatever and screw them, we just told ourselves that these were precious seniors who were FDR Dems who loved Lyn and wanted to do as much as they could to help us and stop drugs or the Russkies etc.


Do not take this revelation of advice on taking prescription medications lightly. If you go to the larouche planet web site, there are many pages from the old factnet.org forum. There, an investigator can read from former LYM members about how the LA office somehow had card tables at certain areas . There was also something very, very similar mentioned by former LYM members.


I am not a doctor, but the key word is "reduced cognitive abilities" when prescribed medications are not available or withheld. A diabetic for example may have severe glucose swings in their body which will effect them if they are not taking their insulin. If one examines elderly abuse by caretakers for example, they don't take everything the first day. It is a gradual process of gaining trust and often being that person's friend in a lonely world. We often were the only people who called our elderly supporters and talked about "the good old days" under FDR or something else.


Finally, don't underestimate other finances like a special needs trust for example that parents of special need children set up when their kids are very young that depending on their independence, may have access to at a certain age as an adult and living successfully indepently .

Originally posted on 2018-04-27 08:12:00
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GUEST_USER
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 05:03 AM
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QUOTE (Worried X-GF @ (time=1524806557))
I would like to mention to him the patterns of abuse that you mentioned,when he gets more clear headed. Any evidence to help show him how much these people suck,and how important it is to stay away from them. They have been nickel and diming him for at least 2 years,I'm surprised this didn't get even more out of hand.



It's probably important emotionally for him to know also that he is not alone in falling prey to them, that he is not inherently stupid or weak, he likely just needed some help and fell in with people who would rather take advantage. Learning a bit about this and other cults could help bring some perspective.

Originally posted on 2018-04-27 10:43:00
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Worried X-GF
 Posted: Jul 19 2018, 05:03 AM
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Shakespeare
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Thanks again for the info,it is so greatly appreciated. Since I gave an ultimatum to Bill,should I assume that they will still try to contact him?
Is there a stepping off period that Cloret and Bill (and any one else) may actually observe?

Originally posted on 2018-04-27 12:41:00
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